Uplifting Chart Commentary From James Masterson

[patrick]

The last line about wondering why they bother is way out of line. He's made small mention in the past of their commercial struggles and how they seem to always fall just one ingredient short of a mainstream hit, which I could never really argue with, but overall he was always more flattering than desparaging as I recall.

I don't understand that attitude. Nobody moans that Bowie doesn't have hits these days, or complains that McCartney sucks compared to the stuff he was doing 40 years ago. We're looking at a group that just had a number 14 single after 23 years in more or less continuously in the upper reaches of the charts. Go West was pushing it (how many groups have that impact after almost a decade) but to constantly expect a return to their '80s impact is just ridiculous. Nobody does that. I don't even know anyone who can name more than two U2 songs recorded after Achtung Baby FFS. It's just the usual rockist BS where PSB get slammed for "only" landing in the Top 20 while Nick bloody Cave can vanish from the charts for years while people wax lyrical.

Very few people have done what PSB have managed to do - ever. It's damn impressive and frankly a number 14 for this band in this age is f*** epic. But they'll never be allowed to be a Bowie or a McCartney. They'll have to prove themselves forever.

[pulse]

Patrick Bateman, you're coming off in the typically cross and crass way, but this time it's marinating in what I find to be the problem with people who haven't fully grasped the new reality. PSB, DM, E - all of those 80's superstars are living in a tiny microcosm of far less sales than the average pop group. They all have fans that buy their albums with more or less no buying help from non-fans.

Until you realise this, you will always be paranoid and angry.

Masterton (not Masterson) is indeed a tool and he's written off Erasure long ago. It was only a matter of time he wrote off yet another of the pop greats.

Why do people care so much? He's obviously got bad taste.

[Propertius]

Masterton's remarks are twaddle. Of course PSB aren't the pop powerhouse they were in the '80s. What's remarkable about "Love, Etc.'s" chart placing, though, is that it suggests the PSB fanbase hasn't degraded (relative to the overall music market) in a decade. In the iTunes era, they can still score as well as they could with I don't know what you want but I can't give it any more or New York city boy in '99. Holding onto that kind of a base for a decade is impressive. Moreover, with acts like the Killers and Lady GaGa taking inspiration from PSB, it seems that they are relevant to a younger generation, and there's at least anecdotal evidence to suggest that there's a small but smart cadre of teens and 20somethings listens to the Pets. All told, I'd say they've held up very well.

[Dipso]

Why do the Pets bother? Because they love doing what they do and they have a very loyal audience.

Top 10 success is always going to be short-lived. In five years' time, most of those currently in the Top 10 will be forgotten. That is the nature of pop.

[Patrick Bateman]

Patrick Bateman, you're coming off in the typically cross and crass way, but this time it's marinating in what I find to be the problem with people who haven't fully grasped the new reality. PSB, DM, E - all of those 80's superstars are living in a tiny microcosm of far less sales than the average pop group. They all have fans that buy their albums with more or less no buying help from non-fans.

Until you realise this, you will always be paranoid and angry.

Masterton (not Masterson) is indeed a tool and he's written off Erasure long ago. It was only a matter of time he wrote off yet another of the pop greats.

Why do people care so much? He's obviously got bad taste.

Oh s t e p h a n o, thanks for explaining this to me! It is, as you suggest, incredibly hard to grasp. It is indeed a wonderful thing that we have such intelligent, rational human beings as yourself amongst the Pet Shop Boys fanbase. Thanks again!

[No Muscle Mary]

Ah Patrick, you're just being cross, crass, paranoid and angry. As usual.

[dVTB]

Masterton is indeed a tool and he's written off Erasure long ago. It was only a matter of time he wrote off yet another of the pop greats. Why do people care so much? He's obviously got bad taste.

It's not the first time he wrote this kind of piece about PSB. I can clearly remember his analysis of PSB singles like Minimal and Numb, back in 2006. His analysis was basically the same as the one for Love etc: Pet Shop Boys only sell to their loyal fanbase. And when you look at the chart results, you can't deny he's probably right about that. It's NOT about his alledged bad taste; in fact he even likes PSB.

And his lenghty explanation about liking the Pet Shop Boys doesn't come as a surprise. Masterton is well aware of this particular forum. Should you doubt that, please read this: http://blog.masterton.co.uk/2007/02/get ... banon.html

What we see here, is simply history repeating.

[Patrick Bateman]

I heartily endorse Janet Street-Porter's sentiments about the man. See you in another three years, Mathieson!

[homer1972]

I quite like him

[Patrick Bateman]

I quite like him

That's because he doesn't have to write about Erasure these days.

[homer1972]

He certainly got your back up Mavis.

[Frequency]

I don't think anyone is denying the facts of the matter; they are a fanbase act and, to that end, they rarely sell outside of the fanbase and it's no real surprise that two men in their 50's churning out pop music aren't as relevant and popular as the likes of Girls Aloud, The Killers etc. However, there's something rather bleak and joyless about Masertons conclusion. I'm not sure exactly what he expects of PSB circa 2009 but they do have a decently sized fanbase, they still make engaging records and still love pop music and the process of making pop records. Why bother ? Because they're the Pet Shop Boys, thats why.

[dVTB]

I don't think anyone is denying the facts of the matter; they are a fanbase act and, to that end, they rarely sell outside of the fanbase and it's no real surprise that two men in their 50's churning out pop music aren't as relevant and popular as the likes of Girls Aloud, The Killers etc. However, there's something rather bleak and joyless about his conclusion. I'm not sure exactly what he expects of PSB circa 2009 but they do have a decently sized fanbase, they still make engaging records and still love pop music and the process of making pop records. Why bother ? Because they're the Pet Shop Boys, thats why.

Well said.

By the way: does anyone agree that "Pokerface" by Lady GaGa sounds like a slowed-down version of "Open Sesame" by Leila K? I'm really amazed to see that mid 90's eurodance is suddenly HOT in the USA (and in the UK too).

If you listen to the original version of "Eh Eh" by Lady GaGa (not the PSB remix), it bears a remarkable resemblance with mid 90's eurodance like "Sex On The Beach" by Dutch act T-Spoon.

At least PSB still try to do something new...

[in_denial]

So the posters that are suggesting todays mainstream Pop is valueless compared to the time when PSB were mainstream Pop hit makers themselves + the posters that feel continuing to have popularity with the mainstream/general public with current material is SO irrelevant - would it be logical to expect they should have complete apathy when it came to the all consuming frenzy the majority of this forum was in all through last week relating to Love etc's CHART POSITION (will it make top10..top20,how much it sold, reasons why it underperformed, reasons why it was such a achievement,etc,etc) ?

Two places down from a lead U2 single is rather incredible a quarter century later.

Surely to bother coming up with explanations for chart placing must infer importance somewhere ,especially when such successful rationalization requires bias from being a fan to be put aside. eg Is it fair to compare such lead singles without considering relative album sales too? Unlike U2 single, Love etc was especially crafted to have more commercial appeal working with (GA's) producers to get a mainstream contemporary sound.So it may not have performed as well without this advantage ?


PS.You'll be unsurprised to know Masterton is regarded as running in joke in chart circles for his pompous,shallow 2D limited thinking + the endless factual chart gaffs he makes from such lack of mind power - clearly demonstrated here with his belief of making music for no other reason but mainstream sales with current releases.

[in_denial]

I don't even know anyone who can name more than two U2 songs recorded after Achtung Baby FFS.

Well i'm not sure about their success in the US but for the rest of the world where their commercial appeal is in line with the UK that is obviously nothing like the case - even though they are a rock act their consistent achievement of multiplatinum albums over the past TWO decades is quite some unique feat.

It's just the usual rockist BS where PSB get slammed for "only" landing in the Top 20 while Nick bloody Cave can vanish from the charts for years while people wax lyrical.

I can't remember PSB in their usual modesty, ever having problems accepting they have been considered a Pop act most renowned for their singles and all that implies for their career as compared to a Rock act.While such an incomparable commercial success for the start of a pop career has it ups it also has it downs. Nick Cave though a rock act has never had anything like the commercial success of PSB - he's had to rely mainly on word of mouth to form such a loyal fanbase as his while PSB also had the behemoth that is the gigantic promo machine of a Superstar in the Music industry but unfortunately i think thats what sets the precedent for the rest of a Pop career. Like the harsh contrast when an act becomes initially renown/focused on for their singles/songs that make such a commercial and even bigger cultural impact, compared to their most recent decade's worth of singles that the (pop music interested) general public isn't even aware of let alone had any impact on pop culture